Sabrina Chevannes: Hi everyone and welcome to this week’s episode of No Bullshit Talks. I’m pleased to be joined here today by Dr. Anissa Reilly, who’s a mother, author, principal, and talk show host, right? Welcome.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: Thank you. Thank you. And I say hello to you and all of your audience out there in No BS land.

Sabrina Chevannes: Yeah, exactly. I’m so excited about our chat today because I feel like you work some magic in your job and you do some fantastic things, but also it seems like it could be quite stressful and maybe even dark at times to have to do what you do.

So we’re going to jump right in. Do you wanna explain to the audience what exactly it is that you do on a daily basis.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: So, on a daily basis, I am a principal of an elementary school in New York City. Yay! Yay! Yay!

And all that I’m in is in the poorest congressional district in our nation, in the United States, right? The poorest congressional district.

So, if anyone understands what comes along with poverty and being poor, just multiply that probably by ten. We’re dealing with all those factors that come along with that, as well as gang activity and a feeling of being destitute.

And so, when you are in a community and you are pouring into the babies of the community, because there is a saying that if you want to change a nation, reach the children, right? When you are doing those kinds of things, there will be forces and mindsets and ideologies that have benefited off of the poor characteristics that will fight against you for trying to do good.

And so that’s what happened as I have been a principal, but I’m here and doing the work that I’m called to do, and I know others call God’s work.

Sabrina Chevannes:I think it’s so interesting when I hear about the sort of differences between stuff in the US and stuff in the UK. Obviously, there are so many similarities between our countries, but also some huge differences.

You spoke about the gang violence, and we do have gangs over in London, but it’s not the same. It’s nowhere near the same extent. We have knife crime, which is pretty bad, and don’t get me wrong, it definitely needs to be sorted out, but again, it’s not on the same level as the US.

Obviously, we hear stories all the way over here and it’s like there are kids going into schools and shooting other kids, and I just cannot even imagine what it’s like over there as a parent to send their children to school every day with the fear that this may happen.

Or as another child, and you know we luckily don’t have guns over here but it’s must be so incredible like what goes through these children’s minds that they feel that is what they need to do to either survive or react and deal with their problems? It must be so scary.

And like I said, being in the district that you’re in, you must see that sort of behavior — not necessarily shootings per se — but just bad behavior and gangs being more prevalent than in other inner-city schools.

How much of that do you see, and why does it happen?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: So, fortunately for us as a school and our city, we haven’t been victims of mass shootings. So, you know, I’m just blessed and fortunate that we are not part of that story.

The story that I can say that we are part of is our students walking home and having to make sure that they are safe as they are passing gangs going to and from school, right?

So, those kinds of things. I know a lot of my colleagues have created safe corridor passages, meaning that there are staff members and community members who are volunteering their time to stand outside as students are walking to and from school to ensure that they are safe and feel comfortable amongst what others are deciding to do — meaning those gangs.

I happen to be what I would describe as a donut hole because my school is in the middle of three rival gangs. But one of the good things I’m going to say is that I’ve been the principal for almost 17 years now, and so I have a long-standing reputation in the community.

Unfortunately, some of the students that I’ve known since they were five years old have succumbed and agreed to be part of gangs. So, between my long-standing position in the community and me being the principal of some of them when they were five years old, I have great relationships.

So, I’m able to negotiate. I’m able to garner their respect. I’m able to leverage that relationship so that our time at school is safe. They protect us. They make sure that we’re good.

And in the mindset of gangs, you build relationships. That’s what leverage does. You can leverage that. Some of them are extremely hurting. I know some of my children who are now in gangs, and I can understand because of their home life, some of them believe it’s their only choice.

I can’t speak for our entire nation. I can just speak for the population of students that I see, that I have been fortunate enough to serve, and the community that I’ve been fortunate enough to serve in.

And with that, it takes some courage. You have to be in a situation where you know that your decision is going to ultimately change lives, and you can only do that if you know for sure that this is your calling versus you trying to get the position through a promotion or seeing it as the next step in your career.

Sabrina Chevannes: Yeah, I mean, you’ve got a lot of stuff that I like, and it’s kind of crazy now. I’m just trying to digest it all because there are so many great points in that.

But I’m just sitting here thinking how you said the word “blessed.” I feel super blessed being in the UK and not having to suffer with gun violence or gangs like this. I’ve never actually really experienced any of that stuff. I know that gangs obviously do exist in the UK, but I’ve not had any experience with this.

So I feel completely blessed, and it’s like a different world. Exactly — just super thankful every day, I guess, hearing these stories in the news and knowing that I don’t have to go through that because there are so many people out there suffering.

I think people don’t realize how lucky they are sometimes. There are people sitting here complaining about their life and saying they don’t have the latest PlayStation or whatever, but think about what you could be going through — having to literally risk your life every single day.

You look at the wrong person on the street or walk past the wrong way slightly and they think they’ve got beef, and it turns into something fatal. It’s just so scary to know that you’re one look away from something bad happening.

So, like I said, I feel super grateful listening to all of that. But I want to talk about what else you do because you also help other women deal with their stress, right? You basically help turn their pain into power, and I think I might say that because that’s how you would describe it.

You’ve obviously been through a lot yourself, which is what spurred you to do this. So I’d love to kind of talk through that and how you got into doing that, what made you start it, and what exactly you do for these women.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: My honest mission is to touch at least one million women’s lives that have had trauma and let them understand that they don’t have to be stuck in their trauma, that they can leverage their trauma for triumph.

And that has become a passion of mine because, as you have already shared, I’ve been through a lot of trauma. When I sit down and give people a little glimpse of the traumatic experiences that I have been unfortunately been a part of, people are like, “What?” They can’t believe it.

And oftentimes, the statistics for individuals who have been a part of the traumas that I’ve experienced are that they have either succumbed to drugs, have either been committed to a mental institution, have unfortunately committed suicide, or are looking like they’ve been through what they call “40 miles of bad road.”

But fortunately, that hasn’t been my story. So because of that, I realized that there had to be a reason why this part of my life shaped me and molded me into who I am today.

And the one thing that I can do is not give the power back to my perpetrators, but now use it as a stepping stone for others. So I can tell you, “Don’t step there. Don’t do that. If you are on that step, this is what you do to get out.”

I have the T-shirt — you don’t want it. So let me show you what kept me going.

And what I found is that it has not only aided me in my healing journey, but it has assisted so many others.

Sabrina Chevannes: That’s beautiful. And you said a million women — that’s not a small target, so that is incredible.

And I mean, I can understand that it also has helped you as well because, you know, talking through your experiences with them to kind of motivate them and let them know what you went through, it must be kind of therapeutic yourself to kind of do that.

But it can’t be easy because talking about these really heavy, serious topics — we’re talking about PTSD, sexual abuse, and all that kind of stuff — these are really heavy serious topics.

It cannot be easy to talk about this. So, how do you get women to even open up about this sort of stuff?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: So, as you said, from sexual abuse, rape, molestation — I have unfortunately been a statistic around trying to commit suicide, those kinds of things.

So because I am not someone who has read the book and says, “Oh, this is what the book says. This is what the text says.” Because I’m someone who has actually lived through the experience, when I share it with particular women — and sometimes there are men too — we are able to connect on that level of not just sympathy and empathy, but true connection because the experience is the same.

So when I share, “Oh, I know what this feels like. Remember when you think like this?” and they’re like, “Oh yeah,” that resonates with them.

So then they’re able to feel comfortable, and because I’m able to say, “Look at me. This is what I did. It’s not easy, but it is possible.”

And so it has truly assisted me because they say when you give, not only are you helping others, but you’re really helping yourself too. When you give, it gives a sense of satisfaction and joy. So that same type of principle applies around this sharing as well.

Sabrina Chevannes: You made a good point that lots of people pretend that it is selfless, people say they’re giving back all the time, and I’m like, no — giving back feels great as well.

That’s why people do it with a selfish reason. You know, you donate money to charity or you volunteer to do something, it makes you feel good. Obviously, that is true, and there’s nothing wrong with that.

You’re still doing a good thing. It doesn’t take away anything from what you’re doing, but just be honest — it feels good to give back to people. It feels good to help other people.

And you know, there are still lots of people who don’t even do that. So, like I said, it’s still a good thing that you’re doing.

But I want to say, I guess when you’re talking about it, I feel like there are so many people out there — therapists, professionals — who can help people through this. But you’re right, it’s so much deeper than just being empathetic because people can be empathetic in certain situations, but they don’t truly know how it feels.

They cannot even begin to understand how it feels. Like I said, they can empathize and they can be there for you, but there’s something so different about someone who has actually experienced what you’ve been through.

I feel that when it comes to trauma counseling or any of that sort of stuff, there really should be someone there who has been through the same experience as the person who’s looking for help because no matter how good you are as a therapist, like you said, there is that deeper connection.

And that’s why I guess people have AA meetings and those sorts of things because they’re all kind of going through it together. They all understand what it feels like to do that.

And I just think — I don’t know your thoughts on this because obviously this is what you’ve been doing and this is the mantra that you’ve been going by — do you think there’s something to that? That no matter how good a therapist you are, you’re never going to be able to truly understand what someone’s going through unless you’ve done it yourself?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: Yes. Let me say, I believe in therapy. I think people should go get therapy because they are trained experts. Like, you know, if you go to a medical doctor, you don’t want to look on the web and be able to get your medical advice, right? You can get some information, but you can’t get your medical advice from the web, right?

So, the same thing with therapists — I believe in therapy. Unfortunately for me, therapy didn’t work for me. Therapy wasn’t my answer because of what you said.

I went to about three or four different therapists and I was just like, “Nah, you don’t get it. We’re not connecting.” I did learn some things, but I just knew that wasn’t for me.

But I know many people have gone to therapy and it was for them. So, part of my learning style is really reading books. I learn and I read, and just something happens to me when I’m reading.

So that’s what I did. I read a lot of self-help books around my particular traumas, and in that, I was able to connect with individuals who had experienced the same type of traumas that I experienced, right?

And so, to your point, although I wasn’t physically with them, just by reading their books and reading their stories, I was connected to them and I could understand that they really went through it because there are only certain things and nuances that you will know about if you have been a victim or you have been in the moment.

Like the lottery — you gotta be in it to win it. So, the same thing with trauma, you gotta be in it to know it.

And so, when you’re reading books from people who are sharing their experiences, and then add on the research, it helps to connect it and bring it home for you as an individual.

So that’s my long answer to say, yeah, there’s something to it. So having a sponsor like AA has a sponsor — you should have a trauma sponsor.

Sabrina Chevannes: Yeah, that’s what I mean. You should. I totally saw that. That should be a thing, and I really think so.

Like you said, therapy is great. And I kind of guess work out why the UK is so anti-therapy, whereas in the US it’s just normal. The UK has such a stigma to it, which is bizarre.

But I just think that in any situation, if someone’s been through it, they will understand so much more. And the person who’s opening up is more likely to open up because they understand them.

It’s the same with anything. If you have a connection, it’s going to be so much more meaningful, and you get so much more out of it.

So totally start a trauma sponsor thing. That sounds amazing.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: Heard it today on the show. He’s a pretty big supporter.

Sabrina Chevannes: Father’s books are great as well. I’m definitely a reader. I’m definitely that sort of person too.

What are some of the books that you’ve read that people who might be listening, who maybe relate to it. Would you want to give some examples of things that actually you know you you ready connected to that we might be useful.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: Oh, one of the main reasons that I read after people maybe really go watch the show — Dr. Phil. So Dr. Phil has a slew of self-help books, right? And I read a lot of his books.

And then the book that I’m reading now, which I recommend to a lot of individuals, is called “What Happened to You?” and “What Happened to You?” is a collaboration between Oprah Winfrey and Dr. Bruce Perry.

And the premise of the book is that instead of asking people, “What’s wrong with you?” you change it to, “What happened to you?”

And when you make that switch in the question, it begins to open up the possibilities of seeing the person through the eyes of the trauma that they have gone through, which will cause them to probably be snappy or curt or withdrawn, or overly happy, right?

And in the book, it’s written in the style of an interview. So Oprah will share a story from her past or a guest, and then that’ll set the stage for her to begin to ask Dr. Perry some questions, which he answers from a psychologist’s point of view.

And he talks about how trauma affects the brain and how trauma really reshapes your brain. In clinical terms, it reshapes your brain, it changes your neural pathways, it damages some of your schema, and what do you do with that?

So when you understand that, then you can do some things to counteract it.

And then my most favorite person of all, because I’m into brain science, is Dr. Caroline Leaf. And Dr. Caroline Leaf talks about traumatic brain injuries and how trauma is a traumatic brain injury, and what do you do to strengthen your brain? What can other parts of your brain do to compensate for what the trauma has done?

Sabrina Chevannes: Those are excellent recommendations, but I think there’s going to be lots of people out there as well who perhaps aren’t ready to talk to someone about it yet, or maybe they’re going through something but they’re not sure if they’re going through it or what they’re going through, and they want to understand a little bit more.

And I think those books might provide some insight on that.

And I think that’s also another question I wanted to ask because there must be a lot of women out there — and men as well, obviously, don’t get me wrong — it’s just obviously you work mainly with women.

There must be a lot of people out there who are suffering from trauma of some kind. They may have PTSD, but they may not realize they have PTSD.

And they may be, like you said, withdrawn, or they may just be acting differently, even being strange with their loved ones. They may be scared of intimacy. They may bad mood or irritable and they just don’t know why.

I would love to kind of get some insight from you to maybe help some of these people probably notice a change in their behavior and they’re not sure.

How do people recognize the signs that they may be going through trauma or suffering from PTSD or something like that? And what can they do about it?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: I’m glad you said that because oftentimes PTSD is really talked about when we talk about military individuals. Yeah, that’s where we most commonly hear that term.

But PTSD is post-traumatic stress disorder, right? So, it’s after a trauma. It’s not just something that happens in the military or from big traumas like a car accident or death or something like that.

But as we talked about, rape is a traumatic experience. Sexual molestation is a traumatic experience. It changes who you are physiologically, physically, and psychologically. Your brain gets reshaped, as I already shared.

So with that being said, one of the things that I realized in my life is that my relationships prior to my husband were all ending in a bad space.

And yes, I began to point outwards and say, “Oh, it was the guys. It was him. It wasn’t this. It wasn’t the right time.” And yes, all of that could be true on the surface.

And I’ll use an example of a tree. When you look at a tree, you’re like, “Oh, the tree looks beautiful, but there’s a couple of rotten fruits on the tree.” Let me just pick those rotten fruits.

You can prune it, but if you don’t deal with the roots, then the tree will not produce good fruit on anything. You can keep pruning, you can keep picking the bad fruit, but if you don’t deal with the roots, then you’re never going to get a tree that’s going to produce 100% good fruit.

So that same analogy is how I can describe what I began to do with myself and looking at me being in these relationships.

So I say that to everyone else — if you see yourself not having good fruit in all areas of your life, but the story seems to be repeating itself just with a different face, with a different job, or with a different relationship, then begin to look at the root of the issue.

Take a step back and analyze yourself, and be honest with yourself that maybe there’s something going on much deeper because roots are deeper than what is on the surface.

But that can only happen if you are really willing to do the work.

Sabrina Chevannes:I think that a lot of people are not good at self-reflection. They find it really hard to take a look at themselves and also it’s not nice to criticize yourself and be like, “Actually, I am flawed in this way and this way.” It must be really hard to do that.

So I guess that people are also in denial if they go through trauma. A lot of people use denial to kind of get over it, right? So they might be like, “Everything’s fine,” and like you said, blame everyone else around you.

And it takes a lot before people can actually realize that something might be to do with them.

I guess another way maybe is if you’ve got a friend who has those symptoms and maybe you could bring it up.

What symptoms are there to say someone’s out there, you know, who’s got a friend who went through some trauma and maybe they’re still suffering and wants to help them, but they’re not ready to kind of do that self-reflection?

What could friends do to help perhaps most of all?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: So, touchy situations, right? Because it depends on how deep the trauma is and if the person is even recognizing that they’re mentally hurting, right? So, if you’re the friend, you have to be very wise about how you’re going to engage your loved one.

We see those intervention TV shows and they’re like, “Oh my gosh,” but that’s because they probably got to a place where it was critical. So, we don’t want to get to that place, right?

What I would say is maybe watch a TV show with your friend and, if a person is dealing with trauma, ask, “What do you think about that?” Just so you can begin to hear what the person is thinking, right? So, if there’s a particular character who experienced a traumatic experience, talk about it with your friend and see how they are reacting to it and responding to it.

I remember one time I was in a bookstore with my husband, and this is before he really knew about a lot of the traumas that I went through. We were talking about a celebrity who had shared her traumatic experience and he was like, “Wow, I didn’t know anything about that.” And I was like, “Yeah,” and I brushed it off and kept walking.

He said that signaled to him that, “Oh my gosh, this might have been something that you experienced too,” just by that. So, he kept it as a warning light and he would find different ways to kind of help me open up.

So, I say to a loved one, to a friend, begin to be very careful, walking on eggshells. Be wise about how you begin those conversations. But if you are in a place where you can have open communication, then I would say make sure you get some language that therapists use to help you navigate the conversation because there are words that could be trigger words to the person who is suffering from the trauma that will put them deeper into it.

So, you have to be very wise. That’s the main thing I can tell you.

Sabrina Chevannes: And that’s why trained therapists are the best people to go to because they know what they’re doing with this. Like you said, one word could just change everything and then they’re in their shell again for good. So, that’s exactly why trained therapists are important.

But I guess, listening to all this, it’s quite obvious that it’s difficult hearing all this. What do people do then? What would you recommend?

Obviously, you deal with this on a daily basis, but you deal with this as something you do. How can these women get help? You know, these people who have suffered trauma, what sort of things do you do for them and what sort of things do you recommend they do to try and get over it?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: The main thing I do is listen without judgment, right? And you have to be prepared for whatever it is that they’re going to tell you. So if you have established that relationship with the individual, you’re going to have to be prepared for whatever they tell you and you cannot be shocked.

You cannot portray that you are shocked because then they will know, like, “Yeah, she can’t handle it. She can’t handle the weight of what I’m about to tell you,” right? The weight of everything that I’ve been carrying over the years, right?

And so you have to be ready yourself. So as an individual who is ready to do the healing and ready to do the work, be very particular about who you are going to engage in conversation with, because the minute that you engage in conversation with someone who can’t hold the weight of your trauma, it will just reinforce in your brain that you can’t trust anyone and that you have to go through this by yourself.

Now, if you’ve already been in that experience where you have shared it and your trust has been betrayed, just know that it wasn’t the right person and you didn’t know any better, right?

But if you are truly committed to healing and living your best life, and as you heard me say at the top of it, you’re turning your pain into power, then I strongly advise that you be very careful. You can test it, give them a little bit of weight, and see how they handle that weight. But for the most part, go with people who have already been through it and are ready to walk that walk with you because you’re going to need it.

Sabrina Chevannes: Yeah, I totally hear what you’re saying because like you said, if you’ve tried before and people have dismissed it or thought it was too much, then you’re already going to handle it negatively. And that’s exactly what you don’t need.

And I can imagine in those situations it’s already hard opening up, and then having someone react by either thinking that you’re overreacting or that you attract drama or there’s something wrong with you. Those are such damaging things and people have no idea how long that stuff stays with someone as well.

Because these things, like you said, those traumas, they are actual traumas like sexual assault, sexual abuse, physical abuse, domestic violence, that sort of stuff. They are difficult to talk about.

And so many victims are just too scared to even talk about it. A lot of victims are too scared to come forward in the first place and report these sorts of crimes because of their abusers. Their abusers may be someone in power, either in their workplace, or in their family, or in their industry of some kind.

And there is a danger in coming forward. Obviously, we know about the big ones in the press, and you’ve heard all the stories there. And we know people come forward and are brave enough, and then suddenly all these people find them.

But what if you don’t have that sort of thing in your industry or your family? And people try to report it and people believe the abuser rather than yourself because of their stature? This is why people have this fear and victims keep it to themselves all that time, making it way worse, having to deal with it.

So what advice would you give to people who are in that situation, who are victims but they’ve either tried reporting it and it’s not worked, or they’re too scared to like what advice would you give to those?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: So I remember when I was in my domestic violence situation, and it was at the height of the situation, the best way I can describe it is where I went to an organization called Safe Horizon.

Safe Horizon is for women, and mostly women, but as a domestic violence organization. And one of the things that I learned, which I offer to everyone, is that you have to have a plan. You just can’t be like, “Okay, today I’m going to get out of the situation.” You must have a plan because we don’t know what the abuser is thinking about. We don’t know how far the abuser will go, right, to get what he or she wants.

Unfortunately for me, I mean fortunately for me, I didn’t become a statistic, but we were trending towards him killing me. We were in a situation where I almost lost my life, but thanks be to God I came out on the other side, which led me to Safe Horizon.

And in the plan with Safe Horizon, because of how serious it was, they wanted to relocate me and my children, change my name, change everything, basically a witness protection type of thing. And we went down the whole plan, the whole entire plan, and I had to make a decision at that moment. And they said, “Well, what do you want to do? Because this is what we’re suggesting.” And I just said, “No.”

Now I’m not saying to do that if somebody is at that point in their life, but I knew deep in my core that that wasn’t something that I could do, and it wasn’t something that I was willing to do, to uproot my entire life because of one man’s decisions.

And so they said, “Okay, just know that this is a possibility, but this is what you’re going to do.” So before I even physically left, there were a serious series of things that I needed to do to get it in order. So when the day came for me to make the decision, I wouldn’t have to worry about these other things.

And so I say to people, the reason why sometimes you may fail—and this is not necessarily with trauma, but with anything—is that you jump before you really have a plan. You haven’t counted the cost. You haven’t analyzed all of the possibilities. You haven’t weighed the pros and the cons. You haven’t figured out how to manage the cons. Because that’s what I needed to do.

And then you need to find somebody, as we already said, who will be there to support you no matter what. We like to say in the United States, a ride or die.

Sabrina Chevannes: I remember that, yeah.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: And hold on to your ride or die. Whether that ride or die is the agency, whether that ride or die is a friend, whether that ride or die is your therapist, whether that ride or die is simply your inner strength, your intestinal fortitude, you know, whatever it is.

Hold on to it. And fortunately, I made the right decision for myself and I’m here, but I don’t recommend that for everyone. You have to have a resolve that no one can deter you from in order to take the steps that I took or make the decision that I made.

Sabrina Chevannes: Yeah, exactly. But it sounds like you were in an awful situation, but you had that inner strength to get you through it, and you had kids involved as well, which always makes it even more complicated. But you know, what if these people aren’t that strong?

What if they feel like they’ve got nothing left, because that’s what happens, right? When victims feel they’ve got no one to turn to, like no one is listening and no one is believing their story, and they don’t feel they’ve got the inner strength to go on, they don’t feel they’ve got any outside support. That’s when suicide attempts happen because they feel there is no other option and they cannot keep living with this horrible feeling inside.

And say, thank you know, rape victims, even though they are victims, they did nothing wrong, they feel like they are dirty, they feel like they’ve done something wrong, they deserved it, that they were asking for it somehow, that they should have fought them off. There’s all these internal blame on the victim when they are completely innocent in all of this, and it just tears people up.

If they don’t have someone they can confide in, or they don’t have someone who is just going to listen to them and respect them and be like, “No, you did nothing wrong,” because they are consistently blaming themselves and that eats away, and that’s how suicide attempts happen. At least like big doubts, depression, and stuff like that.

And that’s my fear, is that there are so many people out there suffering alone and they don’t have the inner strength that you did to kind of fight through this. And you know, like I said, pain is power. You’ve turned this into a whole thing, and now not only have you helped yourself, you’re helping hundreds of other women out there. I don’t think most women are as strong as you to be able to do that, you know?

So what can those people do who are sitting there right at the edge, who want someone to listen to them and be like, “Look, this is what happened, it really did happen, I need you to believe me”? What can they do?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: The first thing I say is, let’s normalize it for the podcast, right? Because we’re bringing it to the forefront, we’re shining light on it. And one thing I do know is when you shine light on shame, it can no longer hide in the darkness.

And then I will share a story. I don’t know if most people know Walt Disney’s story and how Walt Disney became Walt Disney. Walt Disney went to 300 banks to get his idea and concept of Disney World financed. 300 banks told him no, right?

What type of belief in this idea of Disney World could Walt Disney have had for him to not stop after bank one, bank 100, bank 199, bank 300?

Now, if he wasn’t so committed to this belief of what Disney World could be, he would have never gone to bank 301, and we would not know Disney as it is today.

The reason why I’m using that story is because if you truly want to get better, then there is someone out there, you just have to find them. So keep going.

But I also want to say, if you are at that point where you can’t, please know that there is still hope. That does not mean you are hopeless, right?

Walt Disney was able to go to the next bank because he hoped that the next bank would give him a yes. He hoped that bank 301 would give him a yes, and bank 301 did give him a yes.

So you have to hold on to hope because it’s only through hope that you’ll get to person 301. But it’s only through your desire to want to get better because crying at night when the doors are closed and you’re all by yourself is not a happy place to be. And your destiny is at stake.

The children that you’ve never seen, your future generations’ lives are at stake. And so if you can’t do it for yourself, do it for your future generations. Do it for the individuals who are going to look back and say, “Look, Big Mama faced this travesty and Big Mama held on to hope and was able to change out the course of our generation, our history.”

You know, we talk about generational curses a lot of times, and we say, “Oh, that’s what happened to Big Mama, Grandma, Mom, and that’s what happened to me and that’s what happened to my children.” It doesn’t have to be. It can stop with you if you hold on to hope and continue to search out.

There is a book, there is a podcast, there is a YouTube video, there is a person who can come to you, all you have to do is take the first step and be committed to it. It may sound really simple and it may sound really easy, but trust me, trust me, it will happen. You just have to make sure that you don’t give up hope.

Sabrina Chevannes: That’s powerful. That’s powerful. I mean you’re right, it sounds so simple but everyone knows that at that time when you’re going through that, that’s not simple. It’s anything but simple and we all those negative thoughts going through your hair, do you have to fight them and that’s not easy and so you’re right there.

And like I feel like these days what you just said there are books, podcasts and YouTube videos. They didn’t exist 20 years ago.

Like and look how lucky we are. Now we have all these people out there who are giving advice and sharing their experiences.

And obviously all the amazing people like yourself who are out there sharing their experiences are helping other people to know they’re not alone and to know that they are, like you know, they’ve got someone who can support them.

And like you said, have that connection who’s actually been through that.

Like again 20 years ago it was much more taboo. People wouldn’t speak about this or you’re a victim or “damaged goods” you know, kind of thing and it’s changed the perception.

Thank goodness, otherwise the suicide rates would be even worse and depression and everything.

So I’m very thankful that there is so much stuff out there, you’re right. So that’s amazing.

But you know, let’s talk about the fact that you do consistently help people, you know, victims all the time now.

Okay, you said there’s a lot and you said that people need to be prepared for whatever is coming out their mouth. And like I said some people have been building it for years, they’ve been bottling it up inside for years.

Most of this stuff you listen to is really, really heavy. It’s really difficult. Like how do you cope? Because obviously you’re burdening yourself, and I don’t want to use that word because it’s not right, but you are choosing to do this, you’re helping people, but it’s still a lot to carry yourself.

All of these people’s traumas that you are, you know, you’re keeping inside. It must be difficult for your mental health as well. Because you’re having to listen to this and you care about the people you’re talking to. It’s so easy to just think, oh my God, I need to have the personality of that person and then you’ve got all the thoughts in your head of all these people’s traumas.

It must be so difficult. So what do you do? You must have to do something to look after your own mental health in that situation because there is a risk that you’re going to overburden yourself with all these things. And what do you do to look after yourself?

**Dr. Anissa Reilly:** It is like three roads that I travel on this.

The first road is the magic of television. Yeah, when I say the magic of television is because we just don’t get on set and sit in front of the camera and just start talking, right?

So there’s a lot of work that is done prior to me sitting down with my guest. So the guests are vetted, their stories are vetted. I do have people who interview prior. I do have people who may have heard of someone, who knows someone, and we work through their stories.

And the stories are brought to me. So that vetting process, that pre-work that we do gives me opportunities to read the story and sit with it and pray about it and really find out if this is something that I can do as an individual.

So there is that time that we get involved myself prior to us getting on set. Right before going on set, I do talk to the individual and I do say, is there anything that we can’t talk about? These are the things that I would love for us to explore. Is this something that we can do?

And individuals are like, I’m here and I’m an open book. So the minute they tell me they’re an open book, I say great. And I tell them if while we’re speaking, if we’re getting to that point, there is a safe word, right?

And in the moment, I’m as authentic as I can be and as real as I can be. There are a couple of episodes that I have cried and we’re crying together. There are some episodes that I had to stop and say “cut, let’s take a moment, let’s breathe.”

There are times where the guest has asked me to take a moment, and then I said, do you want to continue? And there are times where my producer is like, no, you need to stop right here and just take a minute.

So there are all of those safeguards put into place. And afterwards, my producer is always checking on me, “you’re good, you’re ready to go on?”

So that’s the first one, that’s the magic of TV, right?

And then there’s the road of prayer. I am a woman of faith and because I know this is soul work and because I know that it could be triggers for me, I am in constant prayer.

And I’m listening constantly to God to say if this is something that I can do. Am I at a healing place or healed place in this area that I can engage in conversation?

And I may have thought that I’m healed in this area, but there are so many levels to particular traumas, right? There are so many levels.

And what I found is that there are some times that I didn’t even realize that this happened in a particular incident because you go into survival mode and your brain does protect you from a lot of the stuff that you have gone through.

And if in my prayer time I get a check like this is not for now, then I know that is something that I can’t handle spiritually or my soul hasn’t dealt with.

And then the third road is my desire to help people, right?

And so I’m very careful about that too. Because I just want to help because I know where I’ve been and I know what it can do to you.

And I know how you can still be successful because sometimes even loving someone and not being loved back is trauma, right?

We get sexual molestation, we get that, but even loving someone, having a friendship that has been dissolved, is trauma. Divorce is trauma.

So because I know all of this stuff and because I know what it can do to you, and because the lights are being shined on the big things, it’s those small foxes that destroy the vine that I’m committed to making sure are destroyed.

And not destroying these big parts of people’s destiny.

Sabrina Chevannes:Wow. Wow. I can’t believe it all. It’s a lot. There’s so much that you go through. I can’t believe that you do all of this on top of your day job at school. Like you said, one of the toughest districts in New York. I can’t believe this is on top of all that. The things you have to do on a daily basis is crazy.

**Dr. Anissa Reilly:** You better actually believe it’s purposeful because it gives me a lot of practice.

Because the families that I serve experience the traumas on a daily basis.

And so being able to be in community with them allows me to see it from different angles and see how they are resolved and the strategies that they’ve put into place. And I can offer wisdom as well as glean wisdom because they have been generations in these situations and still are surviving and still wanting their children to do well.

And so it has been research for me in that way.

Sabrina Chevannes: I totally agree and you’re right. You’re almost immersing yourself in that community so you know how to help others in that space. It’s been such an emotional conversation.

But I really want to end on a positive note. So I want to hear about a story of a woman, obviously no real names, who’s come to you with a trauma and how you helped them and what they’re doing now. I’d love to hear a positive story.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: Yeah. In one of the episodes I have a little young lady. She is 14 years old, and her older sister was a victim of a stray bullet while she was on her way home from a party.

Now this was her big sister and she loved her deeply. And as you can imagine, for younger siblings, your big sister is everything, right?

But it was a very traumatic death.

What she realized as she grew older is how she needed to show up.

And so we began talking about some of her dreams and goals. At the time she was 14, and after the loss, she still had those dreams and goals.

Now she is currently producing her own shows. She is helping other siblings because she realized that when a child dies, the parents get recognition, the lawyer gets recognition, the perpetrator gets recognition, but the siblings are left out.

And she said people forget that we slept in the same room together, people forget that she picked me up from school and she’s no longer there.

And so while everyone is attending to the parents, no one is attending to the siblings.

And so now she is doing amazing work. She is going to film school so she can produce documentaries and help tell those stories properly.

Sabrina Chevannes: That is amazing. For me to finish, not only like obviously sorry for her loss, but she literally turned her pain into power and is now empowering other children out there. And it’s turned into this greater good positive thing.

And you’re right, parents do get recognition for it, and obviously the loss of a child is one of the most difficult things anyone can go through. But siblings also matter and people don’t recognize that.

It’s amazing work. I am going to grab those links from you, I’m going to share them in the show notes. And I just want to say thank you so much for being a guest today on this wonderful episode.

Dr. Anissa Reilly: Thank you for having me here. It’s been a pleasure and I hope we get to speak again.

Sabrina Chevannes: Absolutely, I will definitely be in touch and so will some of my audience, I’m hoping. So what is the best way for people to get in touch with you?

Dr. Anissa Reilly: The best way to get in touch with me is go to my website. www.askdrreilly.com/ Reilly is spelled R E I L L Y.com. That’s the best way to get in touch with me but you can follow me on IG @AskDr. Reilly, Twitter @AskDr. Reilly, Facebook @AskDr. Reilly, tried to make it as simple as possible. I’m sometimes you do have to put a period after the doctor but for the most part it’s just straight spelling like that. And to watch some of the amazing stories of my guests who have turned their pain into power, you just go to YouTube for @AskDr. Reilly.

Sabrina Chevannes: That is consistent branding. I’m going to put those links in the show notes. Anyone who just wants to have a click and go through it. But it’s been fantastic today. Thank you so much, and thank you everyone who’s been listening, and I’ll see you next week for another episode of No Bullshit Talks.